Archive for the ‘NEWS’ Category

By Dr. James Ach and Dr. Elisha Weismann (Legal Analysis)

The original intended part 2 (which will now be “Part 3″) is being held in abeyance until details are permissible to be released, if at all.

One question that repeatedly plagued me as I fielded the hundreds of comments that were offered on our Part 1 article was: When did we Christians become so mean? And just in case you think I’m excluding anyone, part of being a faithful believer is knowing when you are just as guilty at failing to practice what you preach, and then being able to admit that in front of those who will likely not only use it against you but make fun of you anyway. As the saying goes, “Your friends don’t need an explanation, and your enemies won’t believe one”. In fact, had it not been for Ryan Hayden and Dave Winter, I probably would have been a lot less restrained in some of the things I’ve said to my theological adversaries, and then I re-read an article that we reposted of Ryan’s about dealing with ideas not character assassinations. It’s one I have to re-read often because of the constant vicious attacks I receive here, and one I’ve had to slow down, take a break, and revisit during the exchanges over this controversy.

Part 1 of our article on the Braxton Caner Tragedy generated over 30,000 views and outranked all of the Google ratings of even the local news reports (information we know thanks to our enemies who told us how shameful that was) and was mentioned by a Fox News contributor in the U.S. That number is still counting. It has generated more comments than any other post we’ve done in the 3 years since we’ve started this site, and there are several hundred still waiting in queue. The traffic was certainly unexpected given our opposition against Ergun Caner’s testimony. Our target audience is a small minority of independent fundamental Baptists, so we NEVER intended to have any significant ranking or increased traffic from a crowd that we are morally and theologically opposed to in many areas (e.g. our views of the Southern Baptist Convention). Due to that volume we probably approved of a lot of comments that we shouldn’t have, and now we are going to take the time to explain why by using a phrase that Guy Beaumont used on me when I jumped on something out of context: “Don’t Get It Twisted”.

DON’T GET IT TWISTED-WE HAVE NOT TAKEN SIDES

One of the difficult things to convey to some of those who welcomed our article with glowing accolades was that we are not necessarily on your side either.  Just because we have issues with James White and JD Hall doesn’t mean we are your “friends” because they are your enemy. In fact, I would have to say that we despise much of what comes from critics like the Patheos bloggers and Wartburg Watch far more than we do what comes from the Pulpit and Pen and the Dividing Line. There are 2 areas in which we have the largest contentions with James White and JD Hall: the King James Controversy (primarily White on that one) and Calvinism. But as I have repeatedly said before, there are many things that White and Hall discuss that we are in 110% agreement with. But the garbage that is spewed on the Wartburg Watch against fundamentalism, and the liberal and progressive rhetoric that flows from that sewage dump of a website is as equally appalling as Calvinism.

Some of the comments that I have received on Twitter and on this website have been from that crowd and are just as wicked and evil as what JD Hall has been accused of. So to those who have arrived at our website from places like this, don’t get it twisted, we’re not on your side either.

DON’T GET IT TWISTED- WE NEVER SAID HALL WAS THE PROXIMATE CAUSE OF BRAXTON’S SUICIDE BUT WE DID BLAME CALVINISM PER SE

Now there’s going to be somewhat of a paradox to this story. On one hand, we are going to show how JD Hall and those who jumped in on the melee can be guilty of causing Braxton’s suicide (next point below), but in our initial article we never actually said that Hall WAS guilty of it. You may be thinking, “well isn’t that kind of playing semantics?”. NO. There’s a difference. We will discuss this a little bit further on regarding Hall’s apology, but the article was meant to show how such actions can be prevented by conducting your differences differently instead of such a bully-type fashion, and that there are theological belief systems that foster this kind of attitude, namely:

*Calvinism is a religion that de-emphasizes the love of God against His sovereignty. Therefore the results of ones preaching in seeking truth and repentance become more important than the means. Please see my comment on John 1:17 where Jesus came by GRACE AND truth. As Jesus said in John 16:2, there are some that kill in the name of God thinking they are doing His service. This no doubt describes the militant attitudes of the Roman Catholic Church and it’s inseparable state empire; Islam, and even John Calvin himself in Geneva.

*A theological system that can not state that God loves even those who hate Him but yet commands us to love our enemies in Matthew 5:43-48 sends a conflicting message which ultimately leads to an attitude of extreme militancy.  In other words, if God Himself doesn’t love your neighbors, how can you love them anymore than He would? And since love is what restricts how we respond to our enemies, without it, there is no filter. The theology of Calvinism ultimately-when reduced to its logical conclusion-leads to absolute determinism which produces an attitude of fatalism  “for the glory of God”. Were it not for a built-in conscience some Calvinists would have already drug Braxton and Ergun to the valley of Gehenna and burned them alive. (Granted, that argument can somewhat work against our contention, but it only betrays the amount of consistency the Calvinist demonstrates to his own theology, not whether or not there can be exceptions shown among other Calvinists.) Would a God who hates His enemy call the man he KNOWS WILL BETRAY HIM TO HIS DEATH, “friend”? Yet Jesus did just that. See Matthew 26:50.

The constant yielding to this type of theology is what sears the conscience into rationalizing that such an attitude against ones enemies is permissible. 1 Tim 4:2. Calvinism speaks “lies in hypocrisy”. It will speak in terms of generally understood rhetoric that are unsupported by their theology. Thus the militancy seen is an inevitable result of a theology that has no more compassion than Islam. When Calvinism redefines what love is, then you muddy the standard on which not only God operated on to save us, but the standard in which He told us to reciprocate to the rest of body of Christ that others may know we are His. John 13:35, 1 John 4:7-12.

Lest anyone think we are the only ones to implied that Calvinism had anything to do with this: consider why this is important to Hall. Hall as far as we can tell is no longer a member of the SBC and even dropped the Baptist name off of his church in Sydney, Montana. Comments like this from Fred Butler make it obvious as well:

‏@Fred_Butler
@2cents4you @PulpitAndPen uh so, what. Stop w/ the self-righteousness. If it was CJ Mahaney or Al Mohler’s kid you’d all be freaking out.

Why did Fred mention Mohler and Mahaney? BECAUSE THEY ARE BOTH NOTED CALVINISTS. So the Calvinists themselves made the issue with Braxton-JD Hall about Calvinism.

DON’T GET IT TWISTED- HALL CAN STILL BE RESPONSIBLE

 One blogger*, Wade Burleson, attempted to bring some balance to this issue in an article he titled about blame not being a game. Wade conceded to much of the hoopla that Hall was guilty of beginning with his initial contact with Braxton Caner, but then proceeded to exonerate him on the grounds that just because Hall acted like a jerk doesn’t mean he was guilty of causing Braxton Caner’s suicide. Wade was gracious, and cordial, and as much as we would like to give him a pass on character alone, the fallacy in the argument here is pointing the focus on causation and that’s really not the point. It isn’t whether JD Hall CAUSED Braxton to commit suicide, it’s whether or not his actions could have been reasonably construed to have provoked Braxton into considering suicide as an escape from all of the pressure generated by Hall’s initial contact, and whether or not such actions by Hall could reasonably be expected to have had an emotional impact on a person that could likely be a consideration in the victim’s contemplation of a suicide, regardless of whether or not such consequences resulting in death could’ve been foreseen by Hall or not. Just because Hall didn’t think about that as a consequence, doesn’t mean that he shouldn’t have. To quote Presbyterian minister, Ian Maclaren, “Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle [you know nothing about]” (paraphrased).

The other fallacy is arguing that Hall could not have foreseen that suicide would be the result of his actions ( a little redundant but we need to expound on that point a little more). Granted, that is a mitigating factor, but is not an exculpatory one. Negligent or Reckless Homicide is still a homicide regardless of whether there was actual intent to cause the death of the victim. A drunkard that gets behind the wheel of a car and kills a pedestrian is still guilty of “involuntary manslaughter” (a form of reckless homicide) regardless of whether he actually intended to kill the victim or not.

Biblical examples of this are seen in cases like the armor bearer and the death of King Saul (1 Samuel 31-2 Samuel 1). The concept Paul introduced in Romans 14 of causing another weaker brother to stumble. The responsibility that God placed on the Watchmen in Ezekiel 3 and 18 for the sinner who dies as a result of the failure of the Watchman to warn him. Granted, these are different scenarios, but all have in common responsibility for the death of someone where the consequences were not necessarily foreseen or expected by the perpetrators. (We have went into greater detail on this in a different article refuting the Calvinist view of secondary causation and the compatibilist’s explanation of human responsibility.) See also Exodus chapter 21. If we don’t know what causation looks like, then how can we expect to know how to avoid causing another person to stumble?

Thus it is not so much that anyone can prove what the proximate cause is of Braxton’s decision to commit suicide, but to make others aware that it should not be neglected as a factor to consider when you choose to  bully someone to provoke a reaction out of your intended audience. It is also not so much that the time frame of nearly 3-4 weeks passing from the incident and Braxton’s demise, as well as the brief exchange between Hall and Braxton was LESS of a factor. That is irrelevant. True, that Braxton was obviously aware of the accusations against his father, BUT THEY DIDN’T INVOLVE BRAXTON. Yes, Braxton went to school and church knowing that others had likely heard about the “Caner Jihad Against Christianity” (James White’s words). BUT THOSE ALLEGATIONS NEVER MADE IT PERSONAL TO BRAXTON UNTIL THE OPPROBRIUM GENERATED BY JD HALL PUT HIM IN THE SPOT LIGHT. Hall and White’s followers have continued to respond with repeating the allegations against Ergun Caner, and that is a complete red herring in this matter.

Watching your dad  on public trial is one thing, but having the attention switched to you personally is quite another and now you have a 15 year old bearing the weight that he is an additional embarrassment to his father, a failure as a professing Christian, and  when Braxton walks into public places, he is looked at as a perpetrator of equal complicity: the PK that is supposed to set a standard for his peers is now publicly exposed as a recalcitrant immoral boy as the result of immorality “permitted in his household” (as alleged by Hall). THAT’S A HEAVY LOAD FOR A TEENAGE BOY TO BEAR. With JD Hall and the assistance of other popular bloggers like Fred Butler, Alan Maricle (“Rhology”), Gene Clyatt, et al, giving it the attention they did, it made Braxton no longer just the son of an alleged liar, but his partner in crime with as much equal responsibility in the “cover ups” as Hall and White have placed on Norman Geisler, John Ankenberg, and anyone who has chosen to support or remain friends with Ergun Caner whether they agree or disagree with how he has responded (or lack thereof) to the allegations about his testimony. The son had now eaten the sour grapes of the father and his teeth placed on edge.

Thus we wouldn’t expect the publicity to have an immediate impact on July 2 and 3. It was the momentum that ensued that merely started on July 2 that caused the most damage.

CAVEAT EMPTOR

A huge caveat in this analysis and discussion is the danger of wanting justice so bad that you allow the “state” to decide all of your quarrels which sets a precedent for them to trample on whatever freedoms any other churches have left in America. The American judicial is no friend to Bible believing Christians and are all too eager to get involved to settle disputes among Christians. Thus, for those who wish to eagerly insist on some type of criminal element to be introduced into this controversy, consider the consequences and backlash from your own government that that can have anytime a negative result happens as the result of a preacher pointing his finger at what he believes to be sinful {correct this <–it’s incoherent}. Christians in America and even here in Israel suffer enough from communities like LGBT for “hate speech”. If you let the government expand such definitions by inviting them to decide your quarrels you are asking to be deprived of whatever liberties you have left. Was Hall negligent? reckless? sinful? undiscerning? Absolutely. But was it criminal? You better think long and hard about that before you go down that road.

BUT DIDN’T HALL APOLOGIZE?

Yes, he did, and in great detail. In fact, we even removed an article about it because I thought it was a genuine act. But that doesn’t erase the damage. It’s like telling the judge you’re sorry for what you did, and because of your sorrow you should be released. Apologizing doesn’t remove the natural consequences of actions you set in motion (speaking allegorically here, not referring to a real judge: a clarification needed in light of how we ended the last section).

But as one person duly noted on our other article, Hall did not direct his apology to Braxton which was the person who needed to hear it the most. And, considering that JD Hall’s own definition of repentance does not involve confessing and apologizing to a private select group of people, but as James White says, “Public sin equals public confession, including everyone you’ve offended”, how can Hall and his defenders truly call Hall’s apology genuine repentance when it is the same kind of “apology” that they would in no uncertain terms reject from Ergun Caner and Timothy Rogers?**(see below)

DON’T GET IT TWISTED JAMES WHITE HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS

It is no secret that I am no fan of James White. And the feeling is mutual. In fact, James White has written of me that I am “beneath contempt” and “unworthy”, among a host of creative pejoratives that he has with my name on them. But James White has been somewhat unfairly criticized in the events surrounding Braxton Caner. We discussed this in Part 1 about White’s involvement so will not belabor that point here. Did Hall ride on the coat-tail of White’s pursuit of Ergun? I think so. It certainly boosted Hall’s cyber presence. But, that doesn’t mean that James White is responsible for how Hall pursued his angle. Hall chose a strategy that James White specifically said he would not have done. Yes, we will give James White credit for whatever random modicum of wisdom he occasionally displays.

CONCLUSION

Now that we’ve had our say about what Hall did, we hope that Hall has learned something from this, and perhaps a lesson for all of us (myself included). I’m sure this will be a hot topic around the bloggersphere for a while, but I honestly hope that those who despise how White and Hall have pursued Ergun don’t respond by doing the exact same thing. Moreover, it isn’t going to happen overnight either, And on that note, I will end this by “letting” God have the last word:

ROMANS 12:17-21

17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.

18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

 

 

 

 

 

 

FOOTNOTES____________________________________

*This article was retweeted by James White who was retweeting Phil Johnson. We find this sort of comical in that James White and friends were so adamant about criticizing anyone who blogged about this issue, telling everyone it was “too soon” and to “just stop it”, but the first article that comes out that gives JD Hall at least some kind of relief gets a hearty ‘amen’ by every Calvinist leader that has remained somewhat silent for the last week and telling other bloggers to do the same. It is this kind of repeated inconsistency that draws the kind of attention that these men think they don’t deserve.

Ironically, I seriously doubt that James White and Phil Johnson who have asked for the head of Ergun Caner on a charger would have retweeted Wade’s article on, “The Fallacy of Demanding Repentance”.

James White @DrOakley1689 · Aug 7

@PulpeetandPin Really? Maybe, as I said a week ago, IT ISN’T TIME TO BE TALKING AT ALL? (Ecc. 3:7)

Retweeted by James White
Phil Johnson @Phil_Johnson_ · Aug 7

Amen. @Wade_Burleson on the Caner suicide and the ugly online blame-and-shame stampede: wadeburleson.org/2014/08/blame-

_____________________________________________

**Pastor Timothy Rogers was accused of deliberately making fun of sexual abuse victims due to a comment made to James White about “what room did your father molest your sister in?”. What is odd about this are the lengths that White and his defenders went in attempting to discredit the testimony of Patty Bonds (White’s sister) and thus claiming she wasn’t a victim at all, but when it became convenient to slander Pastor Rogers she all-of-a-sudden became a victim that Rogers was “making fun of”.

Was Rogers comment stupid? Of course it was. But it was said in the light of a woman who was sexually abused by her father, and was threatened and ridiculed by her brother when she attempted to tell her story. Rogers was sticking up for the victim by attempting to provoke a response out of James White as to his treatment of her, given that White was being inconsistent in demanding something from Ergun Caner that he himself was not willing to do in confessing and repenting of how he treated his sister. It was bloggers defending James White and JD Hall that blew the entire comment out of proportion, and labeled Rogers as a “pervert Pastor” which had NOTHING to do with what he actually said, nor what he meant. Yet this same crowd refuses to give Rogers the same benefit of the doubt that they now demand be given to JD Hall, even after a detailed apology was offered by Rogers similar to Hall’s, and especially given some questionable actions that JD  Hall himself has demonstrated towards a woman not his wife.

The tacky part about this is that there is more to the story between James White, Patty Bonds, and their father that we are privy to that has given us pause in discussing the matter. The big problem here is that it is impossible to not mention it so long as the comment made by Timothy Rogers is still thrown in his face, because the story has to be raised to provide context to Rogers’ comment.

 

[Assistant Editor's  note: this looks like a deliberate conspiracy to slam the borders with known sick immigrants to spread disease as well as chaos into the country. There's just no other explanation for the things that Obama has allowed to happen on the US borders. A scary thought would  be that if the US is infected with so many diseases as a result of this  breach, that Eastern countries justify the use of a nuclear defense response as an excuse to prevent any such diseases from leaving the US into their countries such so much of the world's international travel comes from the US.]

A government-contracted security force threatened to arrest doctors and nurses if they divulged any information about the contagion threat at a refugee camp housing illegal alien children at Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, sources say.

In spite of the threat, several former camp workers broke their confidentiality agreements and shared exclusive details with me about the dangerous conditions at the camp. They said taxpayers deserve to know about the contagious diseases and the risks the children pose to Americans. I have agreed to not to disclose their identities because they fear retaliation and prosecution.

“There were several of us who wanted to talk about the camps, but the agents made it clear we would be arrested,” a psychiatric counselor told me. “We were under orders not to say anything.”

The sources said workers were guarded by a security force from the Baptist Family & Children’s Services, which the Department of Health and Human Services hired to run the Lackland Camp.

The sources say security forces called themselves the “Brown Shirts.”

“It was a very submissive atmosphere,” the counselor said. “Once you stepped onto the grounds, you abided by their laws – the Brown Shirt laws.”

She said the workers were stripped of their cellphones and other communication devices. Anyone caught with a phone was immediately fired.

“Everyone was paranoid,” she said. “The children had more rights than the workers.”

She said children in the camp had measles, scabies, chicken pox and strep throat as well as mental and emotional issues.

“It was not a good atmosphere in terms of health,” she said. “I would be talking to children and lice would just be climbing down their hair.”
FULL ARTICLE ON FOX NEWS

 

See also Alex Jones “Borders Open To Terrorists”.

Lambesis

A so-called Christian heavy metal band whose frontman was convicted of attempting to hire a hitman to murder his estranged wife has admitted that it duped fans into believing that they were Christian in order to sell their music.

“Truthfully, I was an atheist,” Tim Lambesis, the lead singer and founder of As I Lay Dying told theAlternative Press in a recent interview. “I actually wasn’t the first guy in As I Lay Dying to stop being a Christian. In fact, I think I was the third. The two who remained kind of stopped talking about it, and then I’m pretty sure they dropped it, too.”

The publication noted that his wife, Meggan, had likewise divulged in divorce papers that Lambesis had become an atheist. Lambesis, in admitting his atheism, outlined that he turned away from Christianity as he majored in religious studies while attending college through a long distance program.

“In the process of trying to defend my faith, I started thinking the other point of view was the stronger one,” he said. “I remember one Christian festival where an interviewer wanted one of the guys [in the band] to share his testimony, and he just froze up and let one of the guys who was still a Christian at the time answer the question,” Lambesis recalled. “We laughed about it afterward, but we were only laughing because it was so awkward.”

Read the rest of the article here.

Updated November 6, 2013 (first published January 24, 2012) (David Cloud, Fundamental Baptist Information Service, P.O. Box 610368, Port Huron, MI 48061, 866-295-4143, fbns@wayoflife.org) -

zz_JohnMacArthur121205

This is a warning about the dangerous waters of evangelicalism and the fact that many fundamental Baptists are building bridges to these waters.

Recently I received an e-mail from a father who said that his church has begun using John MacArthur’s material for Sunday School. He asked, “Should a parent like myself be concerned?”

I replied:

“I would be extremely concerned if a church started using MacArthur’s material. Not only is he a staunch Calvinist who believes that one must be born again in order to believe, but he is a worldly rock & roll evangelical.”

In spite of the many good things in MacArthur’s teaching and his gift in exposition, Bible-believing parents should be deeply concerned about building bridges to him.

The first part of the following report is from the Middletown Bible Church, Middletown, Connecticut (no date), http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/separate/macrock.htm

John MacArthur hosts a youth conference which is called the “Resolved Conference.” Thousands of young people attend and listen to Christian lyrics sung to the heavy drum beat of rock music. There is no question that rock music is accepted and approved by John MacArthur and his church. This can be verified by going to the “Resolved” website [http://www.resolved.org/].

Peter Masters, Pastor of London’s famous Metropolitan Tabernacle where Spurgeon preached, wrote an article entitled, “The Merger of Calvinism with Worldliness.”  An excerpt from this article follows:

“When I was a youngster and newly saved, it seemed as if the chief goal of all zealous Christians, whether Calvinistic or Arminian, was consecration. Sermons, books and conferences stressed this in the spirit of Romans 12.1-2, where the beseeching apostle calls believers to present their bodies a living sacrifice, and not to be conformed to this world. The heart was challenged and stirred. Christ was to be Lord of one’s life, and self must be surrendered on the altar of service for him.

“But now, it appears, there is a new Calvinism, with new Calvinists, which has swept the old objectives aside. A recent book, Young, Restless, Reformed, by Collin Hansen tells the story of how a so-called Calvinistic resurgence has captured the imaginations of thousands of young people in the USA, and this book has been reviewed with great enthusiasm in well-known magazines in the UK, such as Banner of TruthEvangelical Times, and Reformation Today. This writer, however, was very deeply saddened to read it, because it describes a seriously distorted Calvinism falling far, far short of an authentic life of obedience to a sovereign God. If this kind of Calvinism prospers, then genuine biblical piety will be under attack as never before. The author of the book is a young man (around 26 when he wrote it) who grew up in a Christian family and trained in secular journalism. We are indebted to him for the readable and wide-reaching survey he gives of this new phenomenon, but the scene is certainly not a happy one.“The author begins by describing the Passion, conference at Atlanta in 2007, where 21,000 young people revelled in contemporary music, and listened to speakers such as John Piper proclaiming Calvinistic sentiments. And this picture is repeated many times through the book – large conferences being described at which the syncretism of worldly, sensation-stirring, high-decibel, rhythmic music, is mixed with Calvinistic doctrine.“We are told of thunderous music, thousands of raised hands, ‘Christian’ hip-hop and rap lyrics (the examples seeming inept and awkward in construction) uniting the doctrines of grace with the immoral drug-induced musical forms of worldly culture. Resolved is the brainchild of a member of Dr John MacArthur’s pastoral staff, gathering thousands of young people annually, and featuring the usual mix of Calvinism and extreme charismatic-style worship. Young people are encouraged to feel the very same sensational nervous impact of loud rhythmic music on the body that they would experience in a large, worldly pop concert, complete with replicated lighting and atmosphere. At the same time they reflect on predestination and election. Worldly culture provides the bodily, emotional feelings, into which Christian thoughts are infused and floated. Biblical sentiments are harnessed to carnal entertainment.’ (Pictures of this conference on their website betray the totally worldly, show business atmosphere created by the organizers.)“Truly proclaimed, the sovereignty of God must include consecration, reverence, sincere obedience to his will, and separation from the world. You cannot have Puritan soteriology without Puritan sanctification. You should not entice people to Calvinistic (or any) preaching by using worldly bait. We hope that young people in this movement will grasp the implications of the doctrines better than their teachers, and come away from the compromises. But there is a looming disaster in promoting this new form of Calvinism” (Peter Masters, “The Merger of Calvinism with Worldliness”).

MacArthur’s use of rock music in his own church is puzzling in light of the excellent statements he has made in the past against rock music, such as the following:

“Our music cannot be like the music of the world, because our God is not like their gods. Most of the world’s music reflects the world’s ways, the world’s standards, the world’s attitudes, the world’s gods. To attempt to use such music to reach the world is to lower the gospel in order to spread the gospel. If the world hears that our music is not much different from theirs, it will also be inclined to believe that the Christian way of life is not much different from theirs” (The MacArthur New Testament Commentary (1986)see discussion of Ephesians 5:20, p. 260).

“The association of hard rock with violence, blasphemy, sadomasochism, sexual immorality and perversion, alcohol and drugs, and Eastern mysticism and the occult are not accidental. they are fed from the same ungodly stream. A leading rock singer once said, ‘Rock has always been the devil’s music. It lets in the baser elements.’ Putting a Christian message in such a musical form [rock style] does not elevate the form but degrades the message to the level already established in the culture by that form” (The MacArthur New Testament Commentary, see discussion of Ephesians 5:20, p. 261).

“It should be noted that the many contemporary entertainers who think they are using their rock–style music to evangelize the lost are often doing nothing more than contributing to the weakening of the church. Evangelizing with contemporary music has many serious flaws. It tends to create pride in the musicians rather than humility. It makes the gospel a matter of entertainment when there is not one thing in it that is at all entertaining. It makes the public proclaimers of Christianity those who are popular and talented in the world’s eyes, rather than those who are godly and gifted teachers of God’s truth. In using the world’s genres of music, it blurs the gap between worldly Satanic values and divine ones. It tends to deny the power of the simple gospel and the sovereign saving work of the Holy Spirit. It creates a wide generation gap in the church, thus contributing to the disunity and lack of intimacy in the fellowship of all believers. It leads to the propagation of bad or weak theology and drags the name of the Lord down to the level of the world. The music of the gospel is certainly not a legitimate means for making money or seeking fame, and it must never be allowed to cheapen what is priceless, or trivialize what is profound” (The MacArthur New Testament Commentary, see discussion of Ephesians 5:19, p. 257).

“Rock music, with its bombastic atonality and dissonance, is the musical mirror of the hopeless, standardless, purposeless philosophy that rejects both God and reason and floats without orientation in a sea of relativity and unrestrained self–expression. The music has no logical progression because it comes from a philosophy that renounces logic. It violates the brain because its philosophy violates reason. It violates the spirit, because its philosophy violates truth and goodness. And it violates God, because its philosophy violates all authority outside of self” (The MacArthur New Testament Commentary, see discussion of Ephesians 5:19-20, p. 261).

“It [rock music] does this by catering to pride, by being grounded in emotion, by appealing to the flesh, by watering down the message, by sending a false impression of the nature of the gospel, and by cheapening the Christian life.” Seehttp://data.bereanwife.com/ccm_pdf.pdf

“Now I believe that basically speaking, rock music in and of itself is problematic—period. And I believe that for many reasons. One is: rock music is a product of a disoriented, despairing, drug-related sex-mad generation. There’s no question about that. The first big rock singer was Elvis Presley, who killed himself with drugs and who went through women, you know, continuously. And he gave rise to the whole rock generation. He was the first, and his whole act was sexual, sensual, you know; it was terrible. Nowadays we think he was comical because we’ve come so far. But the vernacular of rock music at this particular point represents a generation that I have real trouble identifying with. And what happens is if you put a Christian message in that vernacular, I think Christianity suffers immensely because I don’t think you can take that kind of medium and use it to propagate a Christian message” [Transcribed from the tape, GC 1301-R, titled "Bible Questions and Answers Part 20." All Rights Reserved.]

We fully agree with these strong statements against rock music by John MacArthur. However, by tolerating and allowing rock music in his own church, MacArthur either does not practice what he preaches or he has changed his position on music, and no longer believes what he once preached.
____________________________

CONCLUSION BY BROTHER CLOUD

Indeed, John MacArthur is facing two ways in regard to the heresy of “cultural liberalism.” On one hand he reproves the emerging “new Calvinists” for their worldliness, while on the other hand he engages in that very thing.

In an interview with Alex Crain of Christianity.com, which was posted on YouTube, Aug. 18, 2011, MacArthur said:

“The fear is that the power of the world’s attraction is going to suck these guys and every generation after them, more and more into the culture, and we’re going to see a reversal of the Reformed revival. … My fear is that the further this thing goes in trying to accommodate the culture, the less it’s going to be able to hang on to that core doctrine” (“MacArthur Predicts Reversal of the Reformed Revival – Part 1,” http://youtu.be/xYhmo5gabQU).

MacArthur, who rightly warns that the heresy of cultural liberalism puts the next generation at risk, is referring to the popular philosophy which was enunciated by Mark Driscoll as the combination of “theological conservatism with cultural liberalism,” which is not new but has always been a major element of New Evangelicalism. It entails such things as Christian rock, drinking, champagne dance parties, beer brewing lessons, gambling nights, hula “worship,” analyzing R-rated movies for “edification,” and performing secular rock in the context of “worship.”

[Editor's Note: For an example of MacArthurites analyzing R-Rated movies, see our article on How James White Helps Spread Islam and Atheism, where Fred Butler's {an employee of John MacArthur} glowing reviews of Batman and Star Wars are discussed]

What MacArthur says about the danger of cultural liberalism is true, but his condemnation of it is grossly ineffective and hypocritical because he is guilty of it.

Camp Regeneration, a youth camp hosted by MacArthur for “churches throughout the nation each July,” is rife with cultural liberalism.

High school boys and girls dress immodestly, engage in questionable activities (such as girls getting covered with wet mud in the presence of boys) and rock out to rap music performed by ear-ringed, tattooed hip-hop artists in an atmosphere of darkened auditoriums, flashing lights, and smoke.

The Master’s College, which is headed by MacArthur, hosted a hip-hop concert in December 2011 featuring Lecrae, Trip Lee, Tadashii, Sho Baraka, DJ Official, and THI’SL. The Master’s College students produce pop/rap/country rock videos with full blown dance routines and covers of secular rock songs. They host a Fall Thing event that is extremely worldly. In 2011 the theme was “Unrestricted Reality,” and the students donned costumes imitating characters from Star Wars, sci-fi fantasy, super heroes, and the pop culture in general. This plays right into the hands of the culture’s fascination with fantasy and the devil’s use of it to corrupt men’s minds. The young people wouldn’t want to dress up this way unless their minds and hearts were already infatuated with Hollywood.

The Master’s College’s annual Week of Welcome features beach activities and pool parties complete with girls in tight and very skimpy bathing suits. (All of this is evident from the photos placed at the Flickr pages owned by the camp and school and from YouTube clips. See http://www.pccmonroe.org/2011/10.htm.)

Can someone tell me how MacArthur is leading the way against the adaptation of the sensual pop culture and why he is a safe “conservative” to follow? He was correct in observing that cultural liberalism will ruin the youth and eventually destroy sound doctrine, and his own flock will be the proof of it, as will those of every foolish pastor that follows in his footsteps.

Many fundamental Baptists are on the same destructive path, as we have documented in the free eBook “Biblical Separatism and Its Collapse Among Fundamental Baptists.” See www.wayoflife.org/free_ebooks/.
___

About Way of Life – The name “Way of Life” is from Proverbs 6:23: “For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life.” The biblical instruction that molds men to God’s will requires reproof. It is not strictly positive. It does not focus on man’s “self-esteem.” It does not avoid controversial or unpopular subjects. It warns as well as comforts. It deals with sin and false teaching in a plain manner. It is reproves, rebukes, exhorts with all longsuffering and doctrine (2 Tim. 4:2). This is what we seek to do through Way of Life Literature. The Way of Life preaching and publishing ministry based in Bethel Baptist Church, London, Ontario, of which Wilbert Unger is the founding Pastor. A mail stop is maintained in Port Huron, Michigan.

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copyright 2013 – Way of Life Literature

SICK of Baptist Perverts

Posted: November 2, 2013 in IFB, NEWS, Uncategorized

Once again, another fundamental Baptist pastor makes the headlines for sexual abuse of a minor. On October 27, 2013, the Administrator of the Kings Way Christian School wrote a letter to all of the parents of its students stating that the ministry had accepted Pastor Bill Wininger’s resignation.

http://douglasville.11alive.com/news/news/473972-douglasville-pastor-quits-after-child-molestation-allegations-surface

Bill Wininger was the pastor of Kings Way Baptist Church in Douglasville, Georgia, where he had been the pastor for 15 years until his recent resignation was given over allegations of sexual abuse by Bethany Leonard, who wrote an 11 page letter detailing her charges.

According to other news sources, similar allegations had surfaced in a previous church where Wininger was associated, and he wrote a book called, “A Church Falsely Accused”.

Here’s my idea for a book, “If Thine Anatomy Offends One of These Little Ones CUT IT OFF” I am so sick of reading about preachers in trusted positions manipulating and abusing young children while naming the name of Christ. God did not give you eyeballs to look upon a woman and child with lust. God did not give you hands to grope and feel up a little kid, and God did not give you a mouth to talk sexually to vulnerable children.

And those of you who work around these preachers that know exactly what is going on, WHERE ARE YOUR GONADS?? You gutless cowards make me sick and I would enjoy just 2 minutes alone with one of you perverts and your defenders to see how much of a man you really are. That child was fearfully and wonderfully made, and was not put on this earth to be the object of your sick affection. And the next time I am in the United States, and I visit one of your churches, I DARE one of you sissies to make a snide comment about this article. Grow up and act like men. “Oh but we’ll hurt the cause of Christ if we report it, who will run the church?” You moron, it’s GOD’S CHURCH, not the preachers, and it’s hurting the cause of Christ MORE by these actions, and you thin-skinned yellow bellies that keep it quiet.

There are thousands of Baptists who love the Lord, and strive to live lives pleasing to God, and study vigorously to win others to Christ, and you IDIOTS make it that much harder every time some new report comes out about another Baptist preacher that can’t keep his zipper intact.

Baptist preachers, deacons, church members, you have GOT to start standing up to the perverts in your church or the church is going to lose all credibility in its witness to the world, and lives are going to be devastated trying to overcome the abuse that your trusted ministers have put them through. If you are a church member that simply doesn’t care, well then stay home and shut up. But if you actually care, then start holding members and church leaders accountable. Now I’m not talking about unsubstantiated gossip, but if you KNOW something is going on, then be a Nathan and claim “Thou art the man”. This nonsense needs to stop in our churches. It’s pathetic.

Dr. James Ach

From the Jerusalem Post

Palestinian Authority president tells pope he hopes to sign peace treaty with Israel.

Pope Francis hosts Abbas at Vatican

Pope Francis hosts Abbas at Vatican Photo: REUTERS

During their first meeting in the Vatican, Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas on Thursday invited Pope Francis to visit the Holy Land.

Francis welcomed Abbas and presented him with a gift in appreciation of his efforts to achieve peace in the Middle East, the PA’s official news agency Wafa reported.

After the private part of the meeting, the pope gave Abbas a pen, telling him, “surely, you have a lot of things you have to sign.”

Abbas responded: “I hope to sign a peace treaty with Israel with this pen.”

Abbas’s spokesman Nabil Abu Rudaineh; Ziad al-Bandak, PA adviser on Christian affairs; and Bethlehem Mayor Vera Baboun attended Abbas’s Thursday meeting with the pope.

Francis, who was ordained in March of this year, has already said he would like to come to the Holy Land in response to a personal invitation from President Shimon Peres in April.

But no date has been set for such a visit, even though reports surfaced that the pope would come in March of next year. A Vatican spokesman said that while the pontiff was eager to visit Jerusalem, no specific plans have been made.

When Francis arrives, it is expected he would visit both Israel and the Palestinian territories, as did Pope Benedict XVI in 2009, and John Paul II in 2000.

To date there have been only three papal visits to the Holy Land.

Abbas’s visit with Francis follows on the heels of an announcement Wednesday night, that Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu plans to meet with the pope in the Vatican next Wednesday.

Alex Jones and Anthony Gucciardi discuss the termination of  Navy Vice Admiral Tim Giardina and Maj. Gen. Michael Carey following leaked information about nuclear warhead transfers.

Click Here Missing Nuke Investigation

In other news:

Common Core Dirty Little Secret “There are four hundred points of data being collected, monitored and stored on every child in the American education system. Monitoring devices are being implemented in our children’s classrooms. All of this is being done under the guise of education reform.”

Israeli Defense Force (IDF) Find Terrorist Tunnel in Gaza 

NSA Spycamp Goes Up In Flames, Delays Program For One Year

California Signs Bill Allowing Nurses to Perform Abortions

Pentagon Spent $5 Billion on Weapons Eve of Government Shutdown

Ranger Told To Make Life Miserable For Citizens During Shutdown

Federal Attorney Warns of Negative Comments About Islam Could Lead to Prosecution and Imprisonment

Newspaper Sues For Names of Gun Owners

RFID Chip Part of Obama Health Care Law (“Obamacare”) (Begins with Ron Paul and Megan Kelly from the US Fox News)

Russia Cracks Down on Russian Muslims-300 Arrested (America could learn a few things from “Profiling” of terrorists and homosexuality from the Russians!)

Joel Osteen God Absolutely Accepts Homosexuals

Obama Uses Own Money to Fund Muslim Museum During Government Shutdown “Washington, DC — While up to 800,000 federal workers faced life without a paycheck as Day Two of the government shutdown kicked in, President Barack Obama held a press conference to announce that he is using his own money to open the federally funded International Museum of Muslim Cultures”

Yesterday we posted an article titled, “Where Was James White” in which we asked where was James White on the issues of the sex scandals at Sovereign Grace Ministries while he was eager to attack Ergun Caner. We also noted his sister’s blog where she implicated him in intimidating her over sexual abuse allegations she has made against their parents. White offered an audio response to this article, although he did not address the issues regarding his sister’s blog. Since James White read directly from the article on his show, we are reluctant to give him the benefit of the doubt that he did not see this.

White begins his audio broadcast by making fun of my name (“Doc Ach” as he laughed), and of course, making fun of my grammar as being “not good English” which as anyone that knows me knows that English is not my first language. But this is typical of many Calvinists who make a habit of ad hominem attacks against their opponents. And while I strive to correct spelling or grammatical errors, I do not make a habit of equating the meaning of an article with the “divine accuracy onlyism” of which White seems to be a proponent of (see his critique of Norman Geislers “Chosen But Free” rebuttal to White’s book for a list of all of Geisler’s spelling and grammatical errors).

At 4:20, White notes that this website makes no mention of his book “The King James Only Controversy” and states that he “almost fainted” in that this is the first website that is KJVO that didn’t mention his book. Well contrary to White’s inflated ego, we don’t think White’s book deserves a highlight on the front page of our website. However, we do have a section on the top of the site that is labeled “King James Defense Sites” as well as a category below that is labeled “King James Only Debate”. As superior and intelligent as White appears to be (just ask him) I almost fainted when he missed both of those obvious clues. We do however, have a section of Will Kinney’s articles of which Kinney has refuted several of White’s contentions about the KJV. (And ironically, Kinney is a Calvinist of whom even though we disagree shows more grace than James White could spell with a thousand word processors.)

We began this article with a clear statement that it may be speculation, and ended the article with “can anyone answer this?”. You would think considering the certainty in which we post the rest of our articles, that such a statement admitting that it could be speculation would be seen as an honest attempt to gather answers instead of an attack on our intelligence from the APOLOGIST (as White critiqued our term “apologeticist” as “not good English” although such a term is commonly used by others, here, here, and here.). White conceded that our assertion that he is popular “is probably true [laughing]“.

We conceded to those who left comments that there actually was no debate between White and Caner as alleged on our article, and stated that the reason we assumed there was a debate was because the You Tube link had erroneously labeled the video “Ergun Caner vs James White on Calvinism”. Nevertheless, our article was never about Ergun Caner or defending Caner. White spent much of his radio show explaining something we really don’t care about, and actually-which may come as a surprise to White-AGREE with James White on this issue that if Caner misrepresented himself as a Muslim to gain credibility among Muslims, he should “come clean”.

At 6:30, White states we should have been aware of this because we “spent hours searching the internet” for it. What we spent hours looking for was White’s response to the SGM scandal, not the Ergun Caner issue. I could almost faint that a man who often accuses KJVO adherents of having “problems with categories” that James White got this wrong and miscategorized that statement.

At 7:00, White states that our explanation of Geisler’s response to White about Caner explains why we are King James Onlyists. Again, another fallacious pejorative jab by White as there have been many King James Onlyists who did not become King James Onlyists because of their assessment of Norman Geisler’s response to White on the Caner issue. Furthermore, we did not contend that White did NOT refute Geisler, we merely contended that both parties IN OUR OPINION presented compelling responses for each of their arguments. White assumes we should have drawn a conclusion in favor of his “thorough refutation” and because we did not, that is what caused us to be King James Onlyists! With logic like this, I am surprised that White has made it as far as he has as an APOLOGIST.

No we don’t believe that White should be involved in EVERY controversy within the church, but the reason that he justified his expose of Caner was ultimately “for the greater good of the testimony of the church”. I would contend that scandals involving sex crimes in the churches present a far greater obstacle to the gospel than one person’s dishonesty about being a Muslim. I have spent countless hours on this website addressing claims of “Do Right” groups, Stuff Fundies Like, Jeri Massi’s “Blog On The Way”, “Baptist Deception” et al, over issues that have led thousands to reject Christ, embrace progressive Christianity, Process Theology, Agnosticism, Atheism, most of which revolved around the treatment of their own children or others involving sexual abuse. So you mean to tell me that Atheism is not an apologetics issue? That when thousands have claimed to have left fundamentalist Christianity because of sexual abuse in the churches, that does not merit some type of response from an apologist? I would submit that far more people have avoided Christianity as well as left Christianity over the issue of sexual abuse in the church, than the issue of Ergun Caner lying about where he was born and who he has debated.

It should also be noted that James White has devoted several hours to the issue of homosexuality on his radio show, and has taped debates with homosexual activists. So James White does appear to believe that sexual dysfunctions are relevant to apologetics, just not ones that reflect issues in his own household?

What is ironic is that in dismissing our question about White’s silence on this, not once did White state that it was an important issue that should be addressed. You would think that since such an issue was raised, White could have at least said something like “As much as I think churches should be more compassionate about this issue, and commit to greater accountability, I am really not qualified to speak on this issue”.  He simply brushed it off as “I’m not qualified to address sexual abuse” and yet James contends that he is not an expert on Islam. If you are not an expert on Islam, and yet engage in debates and write books about it, then why do you have to be an expert in sexual abuse in order to stand up and tell your Calvinist brothers that it’s wrong  and is damaging the cause of Christ?

White contends that he became involved in the Caner issue because he HAD TO, and yet White offered no evidence that Caner’s actions affected his ability to debate or witness to Muslims, nor has White shown that his credibility was affected by anything Caner did. Now White could contend that common sense would lead one to believe that such actions by Caner COULD have that effect, but certainly not enough for White to conclude that he HAD TO respond. But, that’s White’s prerogative and we won’t belabor on this issue since it wasn’t our primary concern.

White states that this is a black eye to the apologetics community who remain silent on such issues as if this is a pattern in the apologetics world when he cites only one example, Caner, of this massive cover up conspiracy that is so prevalent in the apologetics community. Again, I could almost faint at such a sweeping generalization from such a seasoned apologist. And yet the cover ups of NUMEROUS churches regarding sexual abuse which is tearing apart churches all over the world isn’t worth mentioning?

White claims that just because he is a Calvinist doesn’t mean he SHOULD have knowledge about the events at SGM, and then tells me to ‘prove it’. Well at @ the 22 minute mark of the video, White admits that he has received several emails asking him why he hasn’t gotten involved and his claim that it is “utter stupidity” that anyone should assume he has a responsibility to get involved in ministries he is not involved in. If White admits to having received emails asking the same question, then I guess we just proved it!

PETER LUMPKIN’S CHALLENGE

While we’re at it in talking about dishonesty in apologetics, one blogger,  Peter Lumpkins, noted that James White listed in several places, or at least allowed to be listed, a credential that he was teacher at Golden State Baptist Theological Seminary. First let us state that Lumpkin on one site, attributed these postings to Scott Oakland, but a comment posted as James White to us yesterday, one of which White himself referred to on his radio show as his posting, had a return email address of “droakley” so we are not sure if Oakland, Oakley are different people, or one and the same with James White.

Indeed, on the website for Columbia Evangelical Seminary, the following description is given of James White:

James R. White, D.Min.,Th.D.
Faculty Mentor

(Apologetics, Biblical Studies, Comparative Religions, Cults, Exegesis, Theology) Dr. White, an ordained Baptist minister, is Adjunct Professor teaching New Testament Greek, Systematic Theology, Christology, and Hebrew for Golden Gate Baptist Theological Seminary at their Arizona Campus. Here

We do note that James has a Doctorate of Ministry which would be highly irregular for there not to be some course on pastoral counseling or some type of Biblical counseling, and thus it is ironic that James would claim that he is not qualified to speak about sexual abuse. He is also  an apologist that doesn’t have a PhD which is the degree that most apologists have. Nevertheless, Lumpkins asked White to answer some questions about this issue since there appears to be no apparent record of White being a professor at said college as stated in the many references cited by Lumpkins here. Perhaps White will do another show on this issue.

DAVE HUNT

White denies that he ever had a debate with Dave Hunt. But here, is a YouTube video hosted by James White titled, “Is Calvinism Biblical?” in which White is on the phone with a person named Dave Hunt (or perhaps in studio), the man sounds like the same Dave Hunt that I have seen in many other videos, and is the only Dave Hunt I know that has publicly argued against White’s views of Calvinism. Sounds like a debate between White and Hunt to me . This is the debate that White often refers to in claiming that Hunt admitted he was ignorant of the Reformers. Apparently, being an ANTI King James Onlyist affects people’s memory!

White himself admits that Reformers are not necessarily all Calvinists, but yet when Hunt said he was ignorant of the REFORMERS, White was quick to point out that Hunt was inconsistent when he stated he probably knew more about CALVINISM than most Calvinists. Although White claims that it would be unlikely that Hunt learned as much about the Reformers as he should have to have the proper understanding of Calvinism (a claim often leveled against Non Calvinists that we don’t truly understand Calvinism unless we have a thorough knowledge of the Reformers, even though many of them disagree with each other and White never points out just WHICH Reformers we should adhere to properly understand CALVINISM), White can not claim as a certainty that Hunt did not learn as much in six months. Just because White thinks it is unlikely doesn’t mean it is impossible (although White actually made an argument for impossibility).

WHITE’S SISTER

And finally, we were given a link to a blog of a woman who claimed to be James White’s sister, which was then confirmed by White’s response to her blog in regards to Catholicism (an article in which James posts an email from supporters of his sister in which he used the term “Fr.” (Father) to refer to a Catholic priest by the name of Mitchell Pacwa.).

In these two blogs (here and here) his sister, to whom White refers to as “Mrs Bonds”, Patty (we will be courteous enough to use her first name where her own brother will not) paints a dismal picture of several years of child molestation within her home. She states in part:

I was born into the same family as my brother, James R. White. Our parents were both victims of abuse as young people. They carried those scars as people in those days did: silently. Silently, and without resolution, because no one talked about those things. You just toughed it out and did the best you could.

After spending a lengthy time working through the sexual abuse that my father subjected me to for years, I had to confront my brother with the truth.

“my brother James was hostile, defensive, and threatening. He warned me to “watch what I said” about my parents. He also made a very feeble comment about hoping he could “help me” someday”

If James White would take this kind of attitude toward his own sister about sexual abuse (perhaps because he’s “not an expert” on the subject) then in my opinion that speaks volumes about why he would be unwilling to speak out about the issues at SGM.  Now we agree with much of what White said regarding Roman Catholicism, but just because ones family member is a Roman Catholic doesn’t mean you have to throw her under the bus if in fact she was sexually abused by your father. But of course, we understand coming from a religion where God doesn’t love anybody but the elect and of whose founder enjoyed burning heretics for disagreeing with him (both Augustine and Calvin), but would you say that your response to your own sister should have at least included a little rain on the unjust?

And no Mr. White, I have never been to any of your “big conferences” because I am not willing to PAY to see a minister give a message about the Bible.

Now that we’ve corrected our minor errors from the last article, let’s see if James White corrects his!

DISCLAIMER: No vowels or consonants were harmed in the making of this article. And by the way James, is “COVENTAL” Apologetics still on sale? 

EXTRAS:

Please someone tell me, that I’m not hearing things, and that at the 9:05-9:30 mark on the audio clip, White does not sound just like Barack Obama!

The latter half of James White’s show was critiquing Michael Brown on Calvinism issues. We are going to go through this thoroughly later this week, but wanted to address one point here. White criticized Brown and agreed with Brown’s opponent about “Praying like a Calvinist” which presumes that Brown is conceding that God saves people against their will (of course, we understand that since God instills a compatibilist form of freedom within the believer according to Calvinism, White would disagree that it was actually against their will). However, on Whites’ Facebook page, he states that prayers should be offered for Dave Hunt’s wife.

If God determines all things whatsoever come to pass (according to the Baptist Confession of Faith ch 3, )then what does White expect to accomplish by asking for prayer? Now I agree that Ruth Hunt should have prayers, but not for the same reasons White’s theology would suggest. Has White now become Arminian in demonstrating that God may possibly alter an event that was predetermined!

For the Calvinist, offering prayers or telling a sinner God loves them is just a convenient lie to maintain credibility within the community so Calvinism doesn’t appear as harsh as it really is.

James White responded to this article on the Dividing Line and our response to *that* response is here which replaces this. White never replied to our rebuttal but we are leaving this mess of an article up for now as a point of reference since it is referred to in White’s response as well as ours.

UPDATE 9/7 This article will be AMENDED but not RETRACTED IN FULL due to the response offered by James White. There will be issues deleted, and issues added that James did not respond to, and of course, we will TRY (no promises :) to be more gracious in our response to James White’s video than he was with ours. We promise to use a spell checker this time before publishing the edit so that Mr. White doesn’t have a heart attack over KJVOs that misspell words.

We do note that James White repeatedly and erroneously attributed our grammatical errors and citations what we admitted in the very beginning of the article that we could be wrong about to our being King James Onlyist. As if being a King James Onlyist determines the outcome of how an article is written grammatically. 

James also neglected to respond to the comments from his sister.

We will also be adding or rather asking James White to answer the question that was posed to him by Peter Lumpkins regarding his teaching at Golden State.

We also note that James White failed to notice the articles we have hosted on here from Will Kinney that address some of White’s errors cited against the KJV since bragged that this is the first KJVO site that never mentioned his book “The King James Only Debate”. As much as we digress in catering to his ego here, we actually do have references.

White’s response to this article is here. It takes a few minutes to get passed all of his self aggrandizement before you actually get to the response so be patient. 

UPDATED: We have updated this article with new information at the bottom, and comments that give a defense of the Caner issues. We could really give 2 flipped pickled eggs about Ergun Caner’s issue, what we are concerned about is James White’s hypocrisy, and now statements made from his own sister about intimidation regarding her sexual abuse allegations against their parents.

The following may be total speculation on my part, and may be refuted at some later time, of which I will gladly retract what I am about to write, but a pattern I have noticed from James White, popularly apologeticist and debater, has become quite disturbing.

*James White debated Ergun Caner, a teacher and president at Liberty University, over the issue of Calvinism [Accordingly, this information will be amended as there has been no evidence of an actual debate. A supporter of James White erroneously labeled a video link as "Ergun Caner vs. James White On Calvinism" but it is merely excerpts of a sermon by Caner. James White claims that Caner changed the rules for the debate 12 days prior to the debate, so White canceled from fear that Caner would again change the rules hours before the debate was scheduled. I have not heard the other side of this excuse but seems to be the second or third time we have heard such excuses, ie. Peter Ruckman where White did not post the final letter sent to him by Ruckman]. In 2010, James White later went on a personal witch hunt to dig up dirt on Caner which led to a large controversy over the veracity of Caner’s testimony that he was actually raised in Turkey as a Muslim as he has claimed for several years, a matter of which 3 years later, White is still addressing [1]I have watch White’s videos on this, I have also read Dr. Norman Geisler’s exhaustive response [2] . Both sides have compelling arguments.

But what concerns me most is James White’s MOTIVE for searching out this information? James White has an extensive history of debating Muslims, and thus should have been (and likely was) aware for quite some time that Caner was also among the noted scholars that debated Muslims. Yet White’s attack on Caner seems to have come only AFTER his debate with White on Calvinism. [3]

White published a book titled “The Potter’s Freedom”, a response to Norman Geisler’s book, “Chosen But Free”, Geisler’s refutation of Calvinism. Geisler then published a video response to White’s book titled “Why I Am Not A Five-Point Calvinist” . White is now accusing Norman Geisler of covering up for Ergun Caner and demanding that Geisler remove Caner from his position in Geisler’s ministry.

White also had a debate with Dave Hunt over Calvinism, and White later accuses Dave Hunt of misrepresenting Calvinism and being dishonest about his knowledge of the Reformers. One James White support even goes so far as to accuse Dave Hunt (now deceased) of refuting Calvinism due to a Jesuit conspiracy. [4]

Now here is my question for James White.

With all the controversy that he stirred over Ergun Caner, and the amount of evidence that he amassed to argue his case, enough to demand that he resign his position, how is it that James White remains SILENT about the lawsuit and allegations against C.J. Mahaney and Sovereign Grace Ministries (“SGM”) involving the cover ups of dozens of sex crimes and abuse cases?? SGM is undoubtedly one of the most popular Calvinist movements in the United States, and several of C.J. Mahaney’s cohorts are also collegues of James White (Mark Dever, Albert Mohler, Ligon Duncan). Some of SGM’s own staff published accusations against C.J. Mahaney. [5] .

With such a high-profile lawsuit and accusations against one of the most popular Calvinist groups extant, it would be foolish to think that James White was/is not privy to these matters. And yet from what I have been able to find (or rather unable to find) is any response from James White whatsoever about the abuse at Sovereign Grace Ministries. I have spent hours upon hours scouring the internet for a response from White and have found none.

James White was eager (3 years in the running now) to oust Ergun Caner for being dishonest about where he was born and demanding that those whom he serves with in ministry denounce him, but when it comes to his own camp about SEXUAL ABUSE, James White is SILENT.

Can anyone explain this??

UPDATE: We have also learned from other sources that James White’s sister has called him out intimidating her for her allegations of sexual abuse at the hands of their parents. She states in part:

I was born into the same family as my brother, James R. White. Our parents were both victims of abuse as young people. They carried those scars as people in those days did: silently. Silently, and without resolution, because no one talked about those things. You just toughed it out and did the best you could.

After spending a lengthy time working through the sexual abuse that my father subjected me to for years, I had to confront my brother with the truth.

“my brother James was hostile, defensive, and threatening. He warned me to “watch what I said” about my parents. He also made a very feeble comment about hoping he could “help me” someday” http://abbaslittlegirl.blogspot.com/2009/04/out-of-darkness-cross-i-carry.html

And her follow up story here: http://abbaslittlegirl.blogspot.com/p/out-of-darkness-rough-draft.html

We have found at least one response from James White but does not appear to address his sisters sexual abuse allegations. What is odd though is White repeatedly refers to his sister by her married name, and as “Mrs Bonds” instead of “Patty” or “My sister” and refers to the Catholic priests he mentions as “FR” (for “Father”).

 

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Those reading this should also consider reading the following:

 

How “Gays” Treat Christians

Posted: July 6, 2013 in NEWS

While much is touted by the homosexual community about “tolerance” and “hatred” toward the “gay” community, posted below is a recent video of gay supporters attacking Christians at a “gay-pride” rally, and beating a man who is merely holding up a sign.

Full story here.  CAUTION: There is quite a bit of disturbing language in the video.