KJV Defense of Romans 8:1: Rebuttal to “Baptist Deception”

Posted: May 25, 2013 in King James Only Debate

Some Bible agnostic who maintains an anti-Baptist website  wrote an article about Romans 8:1 being deceptive in the KJV.Even though a Baptist didn’t translate it, somehow the Baptists deliberately deceive the masses by its usage.  It is clear that the man has no clear understanding of what the text means even without the overwhelming manuscript evidence to support its inclusion into the KJV (including several Bibles that included it BEFORE the KJV). But that’s no surprise from the Alexandrian Cult. They spend so much time trying to debunk the Bible that they never really learn the Bible in ANY version let alone the KJV.

Mr Bible Agnostic quotes:

“So let’s spell this out in a little different way that may make things a little more clear. According the [sic]the KJV (and the NKJV) Romans 8:1-2 lists the requirements for having “no condemnation” as “being in Christ” AND “walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit”. According to the NLT (and every other translation except the KJV and NKJV – Hmmmmmm) Roman’s 8:1-2 lists the requirements for having “no condemnation” as “belonging to Christ Jesus.” (Notice the little period at the end? That means there’s nothing else.)”

First of all, Romans 8:1 does not say this is a “requirement” for being in Christ. This is the typical straw man tactics used by Bible critics. The entire 3 chapters section of Romans 6-8 are describing the life of the believer over the flesh and without the law. Walking in the Spirit is a trademark of being a Christian. 1 John 5:2 says “By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments”.

Paul is not saying that those who are in Christ were placed in Christ by not walking in the flesh. Paul is using this phrase to identify a professing Christian. A person who is truly in Christ does not walk after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Galations 5:16. The very first half of the verse shows that the persons who are not under condemnation are those who are in Christ, the second half of the verse identifies what that Christian looks like. Paul is describing the believer who does not rely on his flesh to save him, and then continues that life by not walking in the flesh but by the Spirit of God.

Secondly, in verse 13, Paul says “For if ye live after the flesh YE SHALL DIE”. So it is clear in verse 13 that the context is showing that the term “condemnation” means the death of a person who believes they can be a Christian or even become a Christian by doing so according to their flesh (WORKS).  The old axiom “when the Bible says ‘therefore’ find out what it’s there for” applies. Romans 8:1 “therefore” ties in to Romans 7:24-25

O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin”

Ironically, the exact same phrase in Romans 8:1 is repeated in verse 4 WHICH  IS INCLUDED IN THE NLT that the Baptist Deception Agnostic claims to be erroneous in 8:1:

“He did this so that the just requirement of the law would be fully satisfied for us, who no longer follow our sinful nature but instead follow the Spirit.  New Living Translation (NLT)”  Ditto the NIV, The Good News Translation, the ESV (“in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.”)

So the very same argument that Mr Bible Agnostic uses to refute the KJV appears in his own favored translation *just 3 verses later, and also appears in numerous other versions that don’t follow their own rules from Romans 8:1 to Romans 8:4. (*Mr Bible agnostic quotes from the ESV often on his website so perhaps that is his favored version. He uses so many it’s hard to tell! But even the ESV uses the same phrase in 8:4).

Mr Bible Agnostic also states, ” Notice the little period at the end? That means there’s nothing else.” Really? What hermeneutics class did you take in gradeschool?

So much for “Baptist Deception”. Who’s really doing the deceiving here! ~Dr James Ach



By Keith Dotzler

                    Romans 8:1

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Jesus Christ has given us the most valuable gift in the world dear readers…and it cost us nothing! He died on the Cross of Calvary, taking upon Himself the sins of us all. He suffered through scourging, spitting, slapping, a crown of thorns, a spear in the side, the nails through his feet and hands, and His Father forsaking Him…all that we might live! Can you comprehend the shear magnitude of what Jesus Christ endured for us? He paid the highest price possible…to save them that were lost! Because of that great and awesome sacrifice, we now have access to the Throne of Grace, and Heaven itself! As Christians, we are no longer condemned to hell. We have been plucked out of the fire. But my friends, do we as Christians face condemnation in ANY way, for things we may do that displease the Lord? I believe we do, but the new bibles on the market, by omitting the last 10 words of Romans 8:1, give an entirely different doctrine! The new bibles would have us believe Christians will NEVER face condemnation of any kind…no matter what we do in the flesh! This is simply unbiblical, and borderline heresy! This article is written for one purpose friend…to show that the new bibles have gone against the 3 commands in Scripture, regarding tampering with God’s words:

Deuteronomy 4:2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.Proverbs 30:6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.

Revelation 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

Notice, there is a warning at the beginning, middle, and end of the Bible! Some say the warning in Revelation is for that book alone…alright, I suppose the warnings in Deuteronomy and Proverbs are only for those respective books as well? All bibles aren’t saying the same thing folks, so either the KJV has added to the word of God, or the new bibles have taken away from it. By the time we have concluded, you will know who is guilty of going against the Scriptures! With that said, let’s proceed–

First, I will again give the text of our study:

“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”

Of the 30+ translations I have, both before the KJV and after, only 13 read as the KJV. They are: Tyndale’s(1534), Cranmer(1539), Geneva(1557), NKJV, YLT, Spanish Riena Valera, WEB, Luther’s, Webster’s, MKJV, KJ21, Green’s Literal, and the Revised Websters. All others, including the popular NIV, NASB, NRSV, etc OMIT “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Why do you suppose they would do such a thing? Why have the vast majority of modern bibles aligned themselves against the KJV, by the removal of those 10 words…ten words that were believed on, trusted, and loved by the saints of old? I will answer that with some remarks by a few of the more popular commentators:

“This last clause is wanting in the principal MSS., versions, and fathers. Griesbach has excluded it from the text;” (Adam Clarke)“The evidence of manuscripts seems to show that this clause formed no part of the original text of this verse,” (Jamieson, Fausset, and Brown)

“”Who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit” does not really belong in this verse.” (J. Vernon McGee)

Are these commentators correct? Has our Authorized Version been wrong all this time? Have the “scholars” truly found evidence that points to a gross blunder on the part of the scribes, and by extension the KJV translators? Or is this all just a big fat lie, propagated by the “scholars,” who repeat it to the modern version publishers, who repeat it to the commentators, who repeat it to us? We shall answer those questions in due course.

~The Manuscript Evidence~
Before we begin with the manuscripts, I want to be clear about one thing. The last 10 words of Romans 8:1 are said to be wanting in the principal MSS., versions, and fathers. If this is true, why do they appear in the Authorized Version? Thomas Holland explains the “status quo” line of thinking, on the part of the Alexandrian “scholars,” regarding these precious 10 words of Scripture:

“The phrase “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit” appears in verses one and four. Most scholars consider this a special type of scribal error called dittography, which is the repetition of a letter, syllable, word, or phrase. The thought is that a scribe accidentally copied the phrase from verse four in verse one, and that the textual error repeated itself in later manuscripts.”(Holland, Crowned With Glory, ch 8–as found in the SwordSearcher Bible program)

My, my! Sounds like a reasonable mistake, doesn’t it? Ahh…, but remember friends…we are dealing with the words of God! God promised He would preserve His words FOREVER(Psa 12:6,7; cf. Matt 4:4)! So either He did, or He failed! The “scholars” are quick to shame and humiliate those of us who believe our King James Bible is perfect…yet in the past 400 years since the KJV came out — time these “scholars” have spent inspecting all the “oldest and best,” as well as newly discovered manuscripts — they have yet to give us the perfect and inerrant words of God in one volume!!! Year after year, new version after new version hits the market…and the scholars don’t claim ANY OF THEM to be the perfect and inerrant words of God!!! Surely if they know where all the “errors” are in the KJV, they could finally give us God’s words, without error, in ONE volume…don’t you think? Why haven’t they? Too much $$$ in bible publishing?

1 Timothy 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

On to the actual evidence…

The MAJORITY of Byzantine manuscripts contain the last 10 words in question! Among the cursives: 33, 88, 104, 181, 326, 330, 451, 614, 630, 1241, 1877, 1962, 1984, 1985, 2492, 2495 all have the phrase. What’s interesting, is Nestles Greek Text apparatus of 1978 says the ONLY reason they omitted the last 10 words was because “Westcott and Hort reject the reading!” Can you believe that? Their recent edition no longer says that, but ADMITS that the Majority of mss contain the phrase! They would admit that…yet STILL remove the last 10 words!!! What’s going on here? Are the “scholars” not interested in the evidence, or are they instead basing their “findings” on the antiquity of 2 manuscripts from the 4th century? All will be revealed dear reader…and I have a big surprise for you, regarding one of those infamous 2 manuscripts! Let’s continue…

Some Latin manuscripts in support of the phrase are “ar,” “o,” and “a,” the latter being from the 4th century, thus putting the reading AT LEAST as early as the two “oldest and best” manuscripts…Aleph and B! The majority of lectionaries(thousands of them) also contain the last 10 words. Among the ancient versions, the Peshitta(150 a.d.) contains the phrase, as well as the Latin Vulgate, the Speculum(5th century), Harclean Syriac and Georgian versions.

Early church fathers who cite the phrase are Chrysostom(4th century), Theodoret(5th century), ps Oecumenius(10th century), and Theophylact(11th century). Taking into account that Chrysostom quotes the entire verse, in the 4th century, WORD FOR WORD as it appears in the Authorized Version…along with the Peshitta of the 2nd century containing the phrase, it is CLEAR to those with eyes to see that the reading was genuine from the beginning, then was removed by the corrupt manuscripts, from whence all the modern bibles originate!

CHRYSOSTOM (4th century) – “And as to our having received more abundant help, hear thou Paul, when he saith,” There is therefore no condemnation now to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit: for the law of the Spirit of life hath made me free from the law of sin and death.” (Homilies, #16, pg 242 as found in The Master Christian Library, Ver 7, Disk 1)

The fact that Chrysostom quotes the verse, verbatim, speaks louder than those fathers who don’t cite it! As a dear brother recently reminded me, “an argument from silence is no argument at all…and would never stand up in a court of law!”

Ok…now let’s look at the evidence against the reading “who walk not after the flesh, but after the spirit.” Nestles 27th edition Greek text apparatus gives the following “evidence” against the KJV:

  • Aleph*
  • B
  • D*
  • F
  • G
  • 6
  • 1506
  • 1739
  • 1881
  • and a “few” othersAnd according to the Expositor’s Greek New Testament:
  • the Egyptian and Ethiopic versions
  • Origen
  • Athanasius(There is some question though, as to whether he even cites the VERSE, let alone omits the phrase!)THAT’S IT! That’s the ONLY evidence against the last 10 words of Romans 8:1, as found in our Authorized Version! I’ll bet you are wondering why Aleph and D have astericks next to them, aren’t you? Here’s where the surprise comes in…Aleph and D have been corrected to read as the Traditional Text! In other words, they support the KJV reading, depending on which corrector you trust(Aleph was altered at least 10 times)!!! Ultimately, this means the testimony of those 2 manuscripts is unsure, thus the short list of evidence against the reading of the KJV is now even shorter! But that’s not all friends! I have another surprise for you, from the mouth of F.J.A. Hort himself! He was one of the men behind the entirely “new” Greek text, that became the foundation of the ERV of 1881(along with Traditional Text readings where the ERV didn’t follow the Westcott/Hort text), and all modern bibles since! Ready?

    “The fundamental Text of late extant Greek MSS generally is beyond all question identical with the dominant Antiochian or Graeco-Syrian Text of the second half of the 4th century.” (Hort,The Factor of Geneology, pg 92—as cited by Burgon, Revision Revised, pg 257)

    Did you catch that astounding admission folks?!? Many today, who oppose the Authorized Version’s accuracy, often claim that the manuscripts that underlie it are from the 10th to 12th centuries(depending on who you talk to), yet Hort himself has just told us they are IDENTICAL to manuscripts of the 4th century!!! So much for Aleph and B being the “oldest and best” huh?Having shown all the evidence, both for and against the last 10 words of Romans 8:1, I’m sure it is clear to those with eyes to see that the modern bibles have been corrupted! Not only are organizations like Nestles/Aland, United Bible Societies, etc using corrupt texts, taken from corrupt manuscripts, as the basis of each and every new bible that hits the market almost bi-yearly…but when the evidence is, by far, in favor of the reading in the Authorized Version, they willfully CHOOSE to rely on the minority of evidence! Aleph and B are their gods…period. Hort admitted that his goal in producing the “new” Greek text for the ERV of 1881 was to overthrow that “vile Textus Receptus.” He and Westcott, with the help of Origen, Tregelles, Tischendorf, and others, have succeeded. The “scholars” of today, just like Westcott and Hort did in the 1800’s, revere 2 manuscripts above all others…even when the other 5000+ manuscripts disagree with them! And let it be known to you dear reader, Aleph and B disagree among themselves over 3000 times in the Gospels alone! Oldest doesn’t always mean best…unless you are out to make money on the ever-increasing cry for “easier to read” bibles! The Body of Christ has been seduced away from the truth. “Yea, hath God said is still being whispered in the itching ears of God’s people. And, like Eve, they are falling for the lies of the adversary! Wake up Christian! All Bibles are not saying the same thing! They are saying things contrary not only to the King James Bible, but to themselves…and within their own two covers!!!

    When God gave the Ten Commandments to Moses the second time, were all 10 commandments included in the second copy, or were some missing? Oh, I know what you are thinking…some of the omissions in the new bibles, such as the last 10 words of our text, were “accidentally” inserted, as a result of the same phraseology appearing in another verse a few lines down, right? Let me ask you this: the book of Deuteronomy deals with the second giving of the Law. In fact, in Greek, Deuteronomy comes from “deuteros” and “nomas.” The former meaning “second,” the latter meaning “Law.” The Law wasn’t replaced, but was repeated! So here’s the question, if Deuteronomy repeats the Law, as given in Exodus, should it be considered a gloss…and be removed? Was the Law accidentally copied a second time? If the Law can be repeated in the Bible, and not be considered a scribal blunder, why is it that everywhere else where phrases occur more than once, such as Mark 9:44, 46, and 48, they are considered as such…and removed in the next “up-to-date” bible? Don’t be fooled by our adversary friends! The wiles of the devil are so subtle, that not even Peter himself was immune!

    We will now move on to the doctrinal aspects of this gross corruption in the new bibles…

    ~Effects on Biblical Doctrine~I asked at the beginning of this article if Christians suffer any condemnation whatsoever, when they disobey or rebel against the Lord. The modern bibles, by removing the phrase “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit,” give the Christian the idea that no matter what they do as Christians, they won’t be condemned. Part of the problem is that they equate the word “condemned” to being cast into hell. This simply isn’t the case!

    The following is from Barnes’ commentary, where he puts it rather succinctly:

    No condemnation. “This does not mean that sin in believers is not to be condemned as much as anywhere, for the contrary is everywhere taught in the Scriptures; but it means,(1.) that the gospel does not pronounce condemnation like the law. Its office is to pardon; the office of the law, to condemn. The one never affords deliverance, but always condemns; the object of the other is to free from condemnation, and to set the soul at liberty.

    (2.) There is no final condemnation under the gospel. The office, design, and tendency of the gospel is to free from the condemning sentence of law. This is its first and its glorious announcement, that it frees lost and ruined men from a most fearful and terrible condemnation.”

    Being a believer does not make one immune from condemnation when he sins. We are not condemned to hell as Christians, but we are chastened by our Lord when we follow the flesh, and live in sin. Look at Acts 5:1-10.

    Acts 5:1-10

    1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
    2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles’ feet.
    3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
    4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
    And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.
    6 And the young men arose, wound him up, and carried him out, and buried him.
    7 And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what was done, came in.
    8 And Peter answered unto her, Tell me whether ye sold the land for so much? And she said, Yea, for so much.
    9 Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord? behold, the feet of them which have buried thy husband are at the door, and shall carry thee out.
    10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband.

    Ananias and Sapphira were KILLED by the Lord Himself for lying! And they were Christians! We would all do well to remember this event recorded in the word of our Lord! Next, look at Moses. Granted, he wasn’t a member of the Church, but he was a child of God. How was he condemned? He was told he would not enter the promised land, as a result of striking the rock with his staff a second time, when he wasn’t instructed by the Lord to do so! The first time was a command from the Lord. The second time was because he lacked faith that God would provide, and so struck the rock for water, lest they die of thirst. So here is an example of a child of God being condemned for his lack of faith! Compare that to Romans 14:22,23.

    Romans 14:22-23 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth. And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

    The condemnation spoken of in Romans 8:1 is not hell, but putting one’s self back under the Law. As brother Ron Powell puts it:

    “The condemnation of Romans 8:1 is not the condemnation of John 5:24, but the condemnation of Romans 8:13, where a Christian puts himself back under the law. Because of this, God condemns him in the flesh, destroys the body, as in the Lord’s supper [not judging one’s self when eating – I Corinthians 11], with the destruction of the flesh following, that the spirit may be saved, etc. [I Corinthians 5].”

    Amen. Our final example of believers falling under condemnation will be in Revelation chapters 2 and 3. In these chapters, the Lord Jesus Christ instructed John to write unto the seven churches of Asia Minor. Unto Ephesus he writes:

    Revelation 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

    Unto Pergamos he writes:

    Revelation 2:14 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.

    Unto Thyatira he writes:

    Revelation 2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

    Unto Laodicea he writes:

    Revelation 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

    For each thing the Lord had against those 4 churches, He told them what the punishment would be, except they repent! They wouldn’t be cast into hell, but would suffer nonetheless! Believers WILL suffer condemnation for walking after the flesh dear friends! When we stand before the Lord at the Judgment Seat of Christ, certain of our works will be burned up, but we will be saved, so as by fire! We will suffer loss for each reward we lose! IS that not a form of condemnation? The modern bibles have obscured this truth, by removing the last 10 words of our text. Sure, the passages I used for my examples can be found in a new bible, but the very verse that SPECIFICALLY states the condition, upon which we as Christians will not face condemnation, has been wiped out!

    “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”

    In closing, doubtless some will ask: “Does the change in my bible affect someone’s salvation? Can a person get saved by reading a new bible?”

    Of course they can, just like they can by reading a tract. BUT…if your father gave you a solid gold pocket watch, and some adversary of yours came along and put 200 gold-plated digital watches, which are easier to read, along side of it, would you be able to tell time with them, just as you could with your father‘s pocket watch? Did your father give you the digital watches? Are ALL of the watches considered those of your father? The Bible is NOT a book that flows with the ever-changing denigration of the English language! The Bible was given to us from God the Father! He only gave ONE version of His word! 200 conflicting bibles cannot all be the words of God! Sadly, some will fight to the death over the genuine pocket watch given to them by their earthly father, yet the words of God, their Heavenly Father, are treated like trash…all in the name of “faith!” Faith that says“God gave us all these translations to make it easier for us to understand His word in this ever-changing world.” NONSENSE!!! A million times, NONSENSE!!! The Bible is a closed book to unbelievers! Unbelievers are “spiritually discerned” when it comes to understanding the truths of Scripture! If you don’t believe that, take it up with your Maker, for He is the One who said it! An unbeliever can understand only so much in his unregenerate state. Once saved, it is the Holy Spirit that guides us into all truth! It is the Holy Spirit who helps us to understand the Scriptures! Dumbing down the language of the bible, to make it easier for the heathen, as well as for the carnal Christians to understand, is abominable! You are tampering with the very words of our Creator and Saviour!!! And if you can’t understand the “archaic” English of the KJV, then,

    1) You aren’t saved

    2) You aren’t READING it enough!

    I hope this article has been as much a blessing for you to read, as it was for me to write. Praise the Lord for His perfect and inerrant word, found in the Authorized King James Bible! I would die defending the words of my King James Bible, against any and all attacks by our adversary…would you do the same for your NIV, NASB, or other modern “up-to-date” English bible?

    Your brother in Christ Jesus,

    Keith Dotzler

  • avdefense.webs.com
  1. victor says:

    good article

  2. Jason L. says:

    well written and fully explained.

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